Compare nTrack to Reaper, for starter

Quote: (Bubbagump @ Feb. 24 2011, 11:15 AM)

Quote: (nick @ Feb. 24 2011, 4:01 AM)

If you want the best performance from n-track or Reaper treat the computer you use as a dedicated audio tool fit two hard discs one for one for Windows and programs and a separate one for your audio files.

Not at all necessary with R. Just works.

Hellz yeah... I run Reaper on a Zippo lighter with electronic ignition!

:laugh:

UJ

You can configure your computer with what ever software you want and either program will work. The only thing you want to watch for with any computer or audio program are programs that use resources in the background that you might interfere with your audio. Particularly virus software or any of the program that accesses the Internet. Be sure to turn off the built-in sound a your computer. if I’m doing any serious recording on my laptop I have to make sure that all of the various “features” are deactivated and anything connected to modems and video games because of problem on my particular computer. On any computer when I record sound I disconnect the Internet and turn off the firewall and antivirus until I am finished recording.
if possible it is better to have a computer that is used just for recording. Ideally you have one hard drive to run the operating system and one hard drive record the sound. This will maximize the number of tracks that you can record successfully. And if you do not load additional software of course you maximize the potential for trouble with recording and minimize the issue you might run into with something interfering with the audio stream.

I have been using n since ver 1 or 2. The most stable was ver 3. I LOVE N-track. I know it in and out and for that reason I would prefer to use it. BUT IT IS NO LONGER STABLE ON MY COUPUTER. I have an old Aardvark Soundcard and N causes it to crash. it is really wierd but somedays it works fine others it is just terrible. My computer is pretty new and has never been on-line.

One day I had some talented people coming over I had been trying to get in my studio for years. Night before I was setting up and N kept crashing. Downloaded R and it took me about an hour to get figured out enough to record. I have used it for several hundred hours and it has never crashed. It handles all vsti I have thrown at it and has never even hicked.

That said I still would prefer N because it is simple. I still strugle some with R.

Just out of curiosity Larrye what version of Ntrack are you using that is crashing?

I went from 7 stable years on 2.3 to 5.1 for a year and now 6…seems I have dodge quiet a number of bullets along the way, for 3-4 and a couple sketchy 5’s and 6’s…

I am in the opposite boat, NTrack has always worked on all of my Asus’s unless I inadvertently messed something up in configuration or in Windows XP and so far I am unable to get Reaper to work on them (but it works great on my wife’s Compaq desktop with Vista and a stock soundblaster card…seems to be a lot of that going around…

dontcare

You know what I like - that this conversation has stayed civil and dealt with reasonable comparisons. :agree:

Hi bax3:

I agree…

:)

It’s pretty nice
(the Topic and Replies), this is)



I’ll add…
The computers I use are not the Latest-or-Greatest, nor do they have all the fastest and highest amounts of Ram, installed in them…
However, the machines, I use, are loaded with Hard Drives so I can choose where to place temporary and keeper files…
I use "On Board and PCI installed Audio Cards…
No USB or Fire-wire Audio devises…
I use Vista and XP as Operating Systems…
No Windows 7, yet…
I may have to go there eventually…
I have no reservations with loading these machines up with any applications that I choose to use (with “Default” installs , that I choose to install) as well as being “On-line” using Security software, when I choose, as I use n-Track…






I usually install the latest versions-and-builds of n-Track as Flavio posts them…




I use Midi very little and no VSTi Software…
I don’t use many “Free-Ware” VST or DX Applications…
Mostly Paid-for, Effects… If any “Paid-for” effects present issues in combination with n-Track, I get it Fixed or I uninstall the Effect…






As I use n-Track, I continually monitor the CPU Usage screen on the lower left-hand area of n-Track… The-Lower-the-CPU Usage…
The Better…
of course…
I play very little with n-Track’s “Default stall” as it applies to “Record Settings” and “Options” in the preferences…
However I do play with n-Track’s appearance…
as regards to n-Track’s visual looks-and-settings and how-and-where the .wav files are stored on the Hard Drives…




Having said all of that, I will continue using n-Track as my Recording and Editing Application, as long as I continue playing with the Music and Tracking and Producing, that I do…






Bill…

edit…
I forgot to add…
When I install the latest builds as Flavio posts them I always answer the Pop-up Screen when the installation is complete by saying “I do NOT want to keep the present config. settings”…
I always re-set the Config. settings before I use n-Track…




Lately, I have experienced “crashes” as I re-config. the settings of, n-Track, I use… Any time a “crash” develops, a .dmp file is created and sent off to n-Track Support…
After the re-config. of n-Track, is complete I rarely experience any “crashes” while using n-Track…
If I do have a “crash”, n-Track has always produced a .dmp File, that is sent off to Flavio…
I am usually “On-line” and Connected to the Internet as I use n-Track…

One of the things I have discovered about audio and computers - a very good office computer can be a terrible recording computer. I have several computers I have compared the different computers using the same recording interface. - my studio computer is an Athlon X2 64 with only two gigs of RAM - it has almost no right latency. I have an Intel Quad 64 with four gigs of RAM that is terrible when it comes to recording. My new computer is an AMD Phenom II X6 3.2GZ running Windows 7 and it has almost no latency. Latency has nothing to do with the recording software I am using. It’s the way the computer handles audio. I’ve pulled all the tricks I could find on the Intel computer and it still has poor latency. The old Athlon I use is a dedicated computer although I do have office software on it. The new AMD computer as everything on it and even running Norton which I consider a real resource hog it does not show latency unless Norton is trying to access the Internet are running one of its notorious background processes.


http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml

dont care,
I am on ver 6.05 build 2496, tried to install later builds and its even worse.

These last few comments highlight another reason I switched. Reaper runs and runs WELL on every dang thang I have installed it on. The latest n demo wouldn’t run at ALL on my Win 7 netbook. I tried, but after 30 to 45 minutes of dicking around I came to my senses. shrug

UJ

Quote: (Unblown_Jonson @ Feb. 26 2011, 8:15 AM)

These last few comments highlight another reason I switched. Reaper runs and runs WELL on every dang thang I have installed it on. The latest n demo wouldn't run at ALL on my Win 7 netbook. I tried, but after 30 to 45 minutes of dicking around I came to my senses. *shrug*

UJ

I know what you mean but the OP needs to try it for him/her self cos, yeah, one or two people saying that n-track crashes is not a sensible statistical sample. (I too have experienced n-track crashes, and periods of great stability). As I said above there are more posts on the Reaper forum now about crashes/freezes. So it is not without issues.

I prefer the workflow in R now that I am used to it, but there are 100's of things in there that I will never use. n-track is much easier when starting out and gets you recording quickly.

Like Larrye, I’ve found some of the recent n builds to be unstable, but on the whole, V6 has been prety solid and I feel that the whole thing is coming together. Even the midi has become more stable over the last twelve months or so.

This forum has also become more contemporary and less of a place where x n users who got pussed off with V4, defected, but can’t leave.
:laugh:

Quote: (Unblown_Jonson @ Feb. 25 2011, 1:15 PM)

These last few comments highlight another reason I switched. Reaper runs and runs WELL on every dang thang I have installed it on. The latest n demo wouldn't run at ALL on my Win 7 netbook. I tried, but after 30 to 45 minutes of dicking around I came to my senses. *shrug*

UJ

Indeed. I keep seeing
N is great so long as you stay on ver 3 which is 10 years old OR
N is great so long as I blow away all of my preferences on every install OR
N is great so long as I never update or change anything OR
N is great after I jumped through 100 hoops to make it work (Screwing with antivirus, dual boots, etc etc).

I just don't understand the loyalty you guys have any more. Like UJ, I used N for a better part of 10 years and simply couldn't take it any more. My gut tells me you guys are simply too lazy/afraid/intimidated (those were my excuses at least) to learn a different program and explain it away with "Didn't like the work flow" or after spending all of 5 mins in it "I couldn't get my hardware to work" as you never bothered enabling it in the R preferences. Sorry, calling it how I see it and as my gut dictates.

Here what I got:



You see that^^ try to click it ASIO configuration…NOTHING.

and this blue area:



Nothing…but it did say this:



click on YEs…NOTHING, yes I would like to see my audio device configuration…

This ain’t even funny I paid good money for this sh-t…so I know how users of Ntrack that can’t get it to work feel.

Like I said before R works great on my wife’s Compaq with Vista and a soundblaster…right out the box…

my set up in the studio…not at all.

Maybe one of the esteemed gentlemen from the R club can help me here… :laugh:
I’ve tried everything , reloading the ASIO driver for the ONYX, reloading my firewire driver, unpluggin the interface, turning it off and on, rebooting, all the usual stuff.

In any event Reaper has informed me I am eligible for the following updates:

Quote:

REAPER 3.75 is available, with the following updates:

+ Actions: render stems pre-fader now preserve pan law

+ Actions: move media items down now properly creates tracks when starting with a single track

+ Item lanes: fixed overflow bug with large numbers of overlapping items

+ Media item loading multiproject status fix

+ MIDI editor: filter dialog now draws correctly with nonstandard font sizes

+ MIDI editor: undo state saving on CC lane insert

+ MIDI editor: fixed clearing sysex/text lanes causing crash

+ MIDI overdub recording: fixed noteoffs on 0 tick length notes

+ OSX: screenset stability fixes

+ OSX: better looking bullet-mark on MIDI editor CC lanes

+ OSX: Safer unloading of projects

+ Project rate envelope: better sound with PDC/anticipative FX and editing envelope

+ ReaFir: fixed analysis range inaccuracies

+ ReaXcomp: fixed threshold smoothing bug when automating to extremely low thresholds

+ VST: calling getOutputLatency() on resume until first audio block processed now produces more sane results

+ VST: audioMasterGetOutputTime will not return negative values

+ Other cleanups/stability improvements



dontcare

*^^^Those updates^^^^ is that what you were talking about Mark that end up bogging down the system?


Using the WDM Kernel stream I did manage to get Reaper to record one track on the Asus using my on board Realtek AC97 card…Direct sound recorded too on the Realtek, and the “Wav OUt” worked as well…what did they record? not much of anything since I don’t have any sound going to those sources…flat line.

Here’s what I am hearing, you can’t get Reaper to work it’s because you are an idiot and don’t know were preferences is or you just didn’t bother trying…either way it must be you not the program, works on mine! nice.
PS I spent a lot more than 5 minutes d-ckhead, you think poor people just like paying for stuff and give up getting it to work after 5 minutes? think about what you are saying! I wish people would use the logic they so proudly proclaim they have[/end rant].

dontcare

Quote: (dontcare @ Feb. 26 2011, 1:06 PM)

****^^^Those updates^^^^*** is that what you were talking about Mark that end up bogging down the system?

Those look like bug fixes rather than "features". My comments were really related to trying to make software do something that it wasn't intended (or designed) to do in the first place.

The R community is quite excitable about having frequent updates - ie implying that more frequent updates is a better state of affairs. In the corporate world the opposite is true. In my role as Development Manager I was questioned (ie criticised) by customers when we had "frequent" software updates.

What matters the most is the stability of a DAW on your own machine. We can talk all day about which one is in general the most stable, but if a particular DAW runs poorly on YOUR machine who cares if it is typically more stable. I tried three DAWs before I found one that was really stable and didn’t bog down on my laptop PC. I hope to heck the same DAW will be stable on my next system, but this is by no means a certainty. You will never find a DAW forum where you won’t find a subset of unfortunate folks with system configuration issues that can’t be solved.

T

Quote: (tspringer @ Feb. 25 2011, 7:01 PM)

What matters the most is the stability of a DAW on your own machine.
We can talk all day about which one is in general the most stable, but if a particular DAW runs poorly on YOUR machine who cares if it is typically more stable.
I tried three DAWs before I found one that was really stable and didn't bog down on my laptop PC. I hope to heck the same DAW will be stable on my next system, but this is by no means a certainty.
You will never find a DAW forum where you won't find a subset of unfortunate folks with system configuration issues that can't be solved.

T

:agree: I've cloned my recording h/d for safe keeping.
You're not wrong, T, at the end of the day, it's build for build.
Quote: (dontcare @ Feb. 25 2011, 5:43 PM)

Here what I got:



You see that^^ try to click it ASIO configuration...NOTHING.

and this blue area:



Nothing....but it did say this:



click on YEs....NOTHING, yes I would like to see my audio device configuration.....

This ain't even funny I paid good money for this sh-t...so I know how users of Ntrack that can't get it to work feel.

Like I said before R works great on my wife's Compaq with Vista and a soundblaster....right out the box.....

my set up in the studio....not at all.

Maybe one of the esteemed gentlemen from the R club can help me here..... :laugh:
I've tried everything , reloading the ASIO driver for the ONYX, reloading my firewire driver, unpluggin the interface, turning it off and on, rebooting, all the usual stuff.

In any event Reaper has informed me I am eligible for the following updates:

Quote:

REAPER 3.75 is available, with the following updates:

+ Actions: render stems pre-fader now preserve pan law

+ Actions: move media items down now properly creates tracks when starting with a single track

+ Item lanes: fixed overflow bug with large numbers of overlapping items

+ Media item loading multiproject status fix

+ MIDI editor: filter dialog now draws correctly with nonstandard font sizes

+ MIDI editor: undo state saving on CC lane insert

+ MIDI editor: fixed clearing sysex/text lanes causing crash

+ MIDI overdub recording: fixed noteoffs on 0 tick length notes

+ OSX: screenset stability fixes

+ OSX: better looking bullet-mark on MIDI editor CC lanes

+ OSX: Safer unloading of projects

+ Project rate envelope: better sound with PDC/anticipative FX and editing envelope

+ ReaFir: fixed analysis range inaccuracies

+ ReaXcomp: fixed threshold smoothing bug when automating to extremely low thresholds

+ VST: calling getOutputLatency() on resume until first audio block processed now produces more sane results

+ VST: audioMasterGetOutputTime will not return negative values

+ Other cleanups/stability improvements



dontcare

Enough said... :laugh:

Bubba is right...

UJ

Don't sweat it Jerm. About the screen cap thing that is... Now you know. I do recommend asking the Onyx users on the R forum as I think someone there can help. But... if you are doing what you need to do in n-Crap, knock yourself out. :)

Its just that you're missing out on butt loads of super slick editing and mixing features that not just n, but a lot of the 'big boys' don't have.

UJ



so I’ll take that as a no, you have no clue why nothing shows up under ASIO and when it is clicked nothing happens… :laugh: that makes two of us,

Ntrack doesn’t have a problem finding it, shows up every time, V5 and 6.

but I might be exagerratin just a wee bit…I have had to restart the ONXY if the system is idle too long…but I just got in the habit of restarting it before I start Ntrack after I’ve been away…bit I digress…i just want to to WORK! then I can give my sparkling review :D

dontcare

Quote: (dontcare @ Feb. 25 2011, 7:40 PM)

so I'll take that as a no, you have no clue why nothing shows up under ASIO and when it is clicked nothing happens.... :laugh: that makes two of us,

Ntrack doesn't have a problem finding it, shows up every time, V5 and 6.

but I might be exagerratin just a wee bit..I have had to restart the ONXY if the system is idle too long...but I just got in the habit of restarting it before I start Ntrack after I've been away.....bit I digress...i just want to to WORK! then I can give my sparkling review :D ...

dontcare

Nope. I don't have an Onyx FW mixer. The real question is; Have you asked any of the several happy Reaper/Onyx users on the Reaper forum for help?

Just about ALL the FW interface makers recommend using a TI chipset based FW host controller. What do you have? That might explain the disconnect issue with n too?

UJ

PS Put the cell phone camera away and figure out how to post clear screen captures. HINT:

Print Screen key.
Open Paint.
Pasteq
Save as... "my goofy screencap.jpg" or whatever.
Upload to pic hosting site on wobbly-net.
Post link to image file in forum post.
If PC is not wobbly-netted, USB stick the image to one that is... Still faster and cleaner versus a cell cam. :)

Sharp as a tack images you can actually see! :)

PPS I don't mean to sound... err... mean, but if one doesn't know the extremely basic functions in Windows such as Print Screen, it doesn't exactly promote the idea that said user is very proficient in using software of any kind. Its sort of Basic Windows 101 dude...