Feedback....all of a sudden

From where?

I need help. I’ve been recording only acoustic guitar tracks with no problems. Now, however, I’m often getting feedback through my headset and it shows on the recordings. I havent changed a single setting either on my computer or ntrack. I dont know how to stop the feedback. Any advice? thanks

I assume by “feedback” you mean howl-round, not helpful comments from the people on this forum? :D

Anyway, howl-round happens when you have a circular circuit with gain greater than unity.

So, acoustically:

I know you said that you’re using phones, but you’re not doing something stoopid like your monitor speakers are also switched on? (the reason I ask, is because it’s something I do all the time! :D )

Electrical: What is your set-up? You’re not feeding your mixer o/p back into the mixer i/p are you, or summat like that?

Computer: A whole host of quicksand there, and the possibility of sending o/p’s to i/p’s etc.

So, what’s your set-up?

PS, I know you say that you’ve changed nothing, but, something has changed. So either you did it, or the gremlins did.

And many years of experience have taught me that; “Bloody gremlins”, often, after a wee bit of thought, turns into; “Ah, now I see what I’ve done!” :)

With a sensitive microphone and open back headphones, you can get feedback from them, too. An you don’t even have to monitor with excessive volume.

I don’t think he’s talking about a direct feedback loop causing squeal or howl. I think he’s talking about the kind of feedback that could also be called “crosstalk” from the headphones into the mike.

“Feedback” is a technically correct term in electronics and audio, btw. It isn’t reserved as a eupemism for criticism. I’ve seen it used for this very situation in a recording session that was televised as part of the big Beatles Anthology huzzah a few years ago. The artist was David Gilmore, who was recording tracks for Dark Side of the Moon. The control room guys stopped everything saying “Feedback”, and you could hear him grumble “What the #### is rock & roll without feedback!” :wink: Note that this kind of feedback is different from what electrical engineers would call feedback.

First step is to make sure it’s acoustic feedback from headphones to mike. It’s always possible you have some other kind of crosstalk going on. To do this, do a recording as usual, only with the headphones unplugged. Of course, you won’t have any monitor. If the feedback goes away, then it’s acoustic feedback from headphones to mike. Try a quieter monitor or else headphones that isolate better. (Consider a pair of Extreme Isolation headphones for $80 at the Fiend.)

If the feedback doesn’t go away, check all your cabling carefully, as well as soundcard settings. If you can’t sort it out, let us know every element in the input and output signal chains, and what soundcard you’re using.

"Feedback" is a technically correct term in electronics and audio, btw.

Sorry Jeff, I disagree; "feedback" is a meaningless term when used in electronics.

Unless one specifies whether one is talking about positive feedback or negative feedback.

As you know, negative feedback is often used in amplifier design and is a desirable feature, whereas positive feedback seldom is.

However, although the term "feedback" is often used by amateurs to designate "positive feedback", I've never met a professional engineer who does so, (and by engineer, I mean someone who is genuinely entitled to call themselves that).

AS to whether "the control room guy" is entitled to call himself an engineer, I wouldn't know, but I have my doubts.

Howl-round is much the preferred term for that 'orrible screeching noise, and foldback for the "voice of god" from the control room.

And that is not just true for the UK. During my recent visit to several US broadcast networks, I found the engineers also correctly used the terminology.

Anyway, sorry to be a pedant, but it does matter. :)

Wow…lots of great thoughts about feedback. By ‘feedback,’ I’m not saying that I’m getting a loud screeching sound, but I am getting a loud sustained annoying hum when I hit certain notes. A loud annoying hum that wasnt happening before. I have a good condenser mic that goes into a preamp and into my computer. Do I have some setting too high? Recording volume setting? Is the gain too high? I havent changed anything from when I had no problems, but yes, I must have changed something without knowing it. Thanks for your help.

You may not have changed anything inadvertantly; if your preamp has a tube in it (or your microphone), you may have a tube going south. Your description sounds like what happens to my tube amp when a tube starts to die - I hit certain notes, and the thing starts moaning, and won’t quit unless I tickle it (turn it on and off :) ).

If you have no tubes, then it must be something else, I guess! :D

Good luck!

'til next time;
TW

Ali_t, what do you call this kind of feedback? It’s not “howl-around” (a term I’ve never heard).

It’s a form of cross-talk or bleed-through, and it’s also a form of what has long been called “feedback” in studios. The term “feedback” has more than one meaning, like many other words we use (e.g., “compression”).

The purpose of words is to communicate.

feed·back ( P ) Pronunciation Key (fdbk)
n.

1.
a. The return of a portion of the output of a process or system to the input, especially when used to maintain performance or to control a system or process.
b. The portion of the output so returned.
c. Sound created when a transducer such as a microphone or electric guitar picks up sound from a speaker connected to an amplifier and regenerates it back through the amplifier.
2. The return of information about the result of a process or activity; an evaluative response: asked the students for feedback on the new curriculum.
3. The process by which a system, often biological or ecological, is modulated, controlled, or changed by the product, output, or response it produces.

This case fits definition 1.a., though not the “especially” clause. In this context, it’s basically trade jargon used in recording studios.

Pedantically yours,
Jeff
:;):

but I am getting a loud sustained annoying hum when I hit certain notes.

Resonance?

I know this is problem is on headphones, but my room has a couple of bad resonant peaks which can sound like feedback when I hit certain notes. (Loverly!!!)


Mark

By the sound of it, it sounds like a standing wave in the room, that is getting picked up by the mic. Have you re-arranged the furniture lately? Opened up a large section of flat (reflective) wall? We have this problem in our practice room, every note is okay, except for “B” which generates additive interference and sounds about 6db louder than everything else. I usually use gobo’s to deaden the room a bit.

.-=gp=-.

Eddy Kramer revealed in an interview that the “seagulls” sound Hendrix got (which Eric Johnson duplicates by pushing a treble string down on one of the pickup pole-pieces and then on over its lip like a kind of metal pick) was actually feedback. Like many performers in the studio, Hendrix had the cans over just one ear, and his high gain guitar went into his open vocal mic from the other earpiece.

Unless you also hear this standing wave-boomy feedback-at certain frequencies only sound acoustically, there just HAS to be leakage from the phones back in to the guitar mic. As a test, set your levels and then track 20 seconds or so with NO phones or monitors. Listen back and see if the effect is still present. I’d guess not.

feed·back ( P ) Pronunciation Key (fdbk)
n.

1.
a. The return of a portion of the output of a process or system to the input, especially when used to maintain performance or to control a system or process.
b. The portion of the output so returned.
c. Sound created when a transducer such as a microphone or electric guitar picks up sound from a speaker connected to an amplifier and regenerates it back through the amplifier.
2. The return of information about the result of a process or activity; an evaluative response: asked the students for feedback on the new curriculum.
3. The process by which a system, often biological or ecological, is modulated, controlled, or changed by the product, output, or response it produces.

This case fits definition 1.a., though not the "especially" clause. In this context, it's basically trade jargon used in recording studios.

Pedantically yours,
Jeff



Ach well, it's only words! :D

But you've never heard the term howlround? It's much preferred because as you say, feedback can mean many different things to an engineer. (At least it was in my day, but everything is becoming sloppier these days. :( )

Anyway, definition (a) only refers to negative feedback where a sniff of the output is returned in anti-phase to the input; you try controlling something with positive feedback!

But, I suppose that it's an American dictionary you're quoting from, so all is forgiven. :D

But, I'm still struggling with the pronunciation key; "fdbk".

Ah bollox! I've gone and sprained my tongue again. :(

:D

Anyway, the problem here doesn't actually seem to be howlround, or "feedback".

"A loud sustained annoying hum"?

What steps have you taken to isolate and identify it DC?