Karl Rove on Meet the Press

I listened to him today on MTP. He was very articulate & well spoken. He avoided answering certain questions & was probably wise to do that.

I would suggest to you several things to think about when interpreting what the Republicans tell you:

1) Listen to Grover Norquist (sp?) to find out exactly what many Republicans in the admin want. If you’re comfortable with Grover then that’s OK.

2) Look closely at the details when the say things like we need to set up an environment where our business can compete against global business. I would suggest to you that that means favoring business in general over the “little” guy. While it’s true that we do need to be concerned with competing, we cannot & should not do that by screwing everyone in the process & giving breaks to big business.

I’ll bring up one issue that I don’t think the Republicans will address at all and yet needs to be addressed NOW. That is mercury pollution in our environment because of coal burning. It’s a serious thing that has implications for years to come. The Republicans will not address it correctly because they are slanted toward big business.

You talk about empowering the little guy, if I were President, I would have a tax credit for people to install solar into their homes. It would cut down on the coal burning, it would fuel a new industry and it would help the little guy. The Republicans will never put forth such a plan. If you vote for me in 2008, I’ll implement this :p :laugh:

You have my vote! Solar has failed because Oil and Power companies haven’t figured a way to own the sun! I framed and trimmed a house inthe 70’s that had solar hot water panels. This was the best working system I have ever seen, the home owners had it removed because they thought it was ugly with the panels installed on the roof of the house. I didn’t think it was un-attractive, at the time I thought it looked space age! They also had the exterior bricked and then painted the brick white, which I thought was stupid. go figure.

Toker, least I forget…If elected will you implement a new Neil Young and Crazy Horse national holiday?:D

I would suggest to you that that means favoring business in general over the "little" guy.

Explain this to me. By hurting me, the business owner (meager and tenuous as that status may be,) how are you helping the "little guy?"

Who, exactly, is the little guy going to work for? The risks and effort involved in starting, building and sustaining a business are monumental - the vast majority of SANE people don't want to do it for a reason! They want to work for others who do. So come again?

Here in my area, there are a couple simple reasons I am not located in the City of Detroit proper. Both involve punishment. First, I would pay an additional city income tax for the privilege of being in the city. Second, that privilege includes having to live with terrible city services - among them emergency response.

The end result is that business flees the city. The end result of the US having the highest business taxes IN THE WORLD is the same. Yet "liberals" are afraid to ease up on business because it might hurt the little guy.
Quote (YazMiester @ Nov. 08 2004,05:19)
Solar has failed because Oil and Power companies haven't figured a way to own the sun!



Makes you wonder what would be if these 'groups' actually had a 'positive' purpose ...
Something else to ponder ..... ??



Billionaires Donate Millions To MoveOn's Bush Bashing Ad Campaign
By Jimmy Moore
Talon News
November 12, 2003

WASHINGTON (Talon News) -- Two liberal Democrat billionaires have offered to donate at least a portion of their wealth in an effort to defeat Republican President George W. Bush in the 2004 election.

Financier George Soros and Progressive Corporation Chairman Peter Lewis told liberal political action committee MoveOn.org that they will donate $5 million to assist them with their campaign to attack Bush in political television ads.

Talon News reported last month about the MoveOn.org Voter Fund which hopes to raise $10 million to run these ads criticizing Bush. Also, they are currently running a national advertising contest called "Bush in 30 Seconds" asking people to create television commercials against the president.

Soros has long been a major supporter of the Democrat Party, giving $20 million recently to the Center for American Progress, a leftist advocacy group. Additionally, he has already pledged $10 million to a liberal group called Americans Coming Together earlier this year.

As if the money he has already contributed was not enough, Soros has said he is willing to "give more money." Surprisingly, when asked if he would be willing to spend his entire $7 billion net worth to remove Bush from the White House, he responded by saying that he would do it "if someone guaranteed" it would happen.





Windstorm : Why Are 'Environmentalists' Opposing Windmills in Nantucket Sound? (Give me a break)
John Stossel
20/20
July 25, 2003


It's windy enough on Massachusetts' Nantucket Sound — the waters between Cape Cod, Nantucket and Martha's Vineyard — that it makes the Sound an ideal place for windmills that generate electricity.

Wind farms are popular in Europe and California, and environmentalists like them because they're a relatively clean way to produce electricity. It's a reason Jim Gordon proposes to install 130 wind turbines 6 ½ miles off the coast of Cape Cod.

But there's a problem.

Although the Natural Resources Defense Council, and its attorney, Robert F. Kennedy Jr., support wind power (Kennedy says he's "strongly in favor of wind-energy production at sea, but Kennedy doesn't want a wind farm on Nantucket Sound, where his family might see it from their elegant compound in Hyannis Port.


Veteran newsman Walter Cronkite doesn't want Gordon's wind farm here either. Cronkite likes to sail on Nantucket Sound. He did a commercial for a group that's fighting the wind farm. In it, he says, "Our natural treasures should be off limits to industrialization and Nantucket Sound is one of those treasures."

His ad was paid for by the Alliance to Protect the Sound, which also supports wind power, but not on Nantucket Sound




(In the voice of Thurston Howel III ) - " I'm strongly in favor of wind-energy production at sea, Kennedy doesn't want a wind farm on Nantucket Sound, where his family might see it from their elegant compound in Hyannis Port "

"Put one by those 'other' people, right lovey .... "


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It could be argued that you are the little guy, Pete. We know monopolies and rail road barrons were a bad idea. Yes, there are anti trust laws, but depending on who is in charge, they may or may not be enforced or create a favorable envirnment for competition to a certain industry. I don’t think we are there yet 100%, but if you sold bananas and Wal-Mart moved in next door, you would see youself as the little guy. I have real mixed feelings about the whole thing, but just to give perspective as to who the little guy might be.

Your distinction is notable, Bubba. I wish it were clearer where those generally railing against the evil, selfish businessmen were drawing the line… so I know when I’ve crossed it, perhaps?

Um, if you are buying and selling small African countries and their futures for your revenues, you have gone too far. :;):

1) Listen to Grover Norquist (sp?) to find out exactly what many Republicans in the admin want. If you're comfortable with Grover then that's OK.
Do you really think that it's wise to listen to one person to get all of your information about one party's goals?

I certainly did not listen to only Senator Kerry in regards to the Democratic policies that would be implimented under a democratic president.
Explain this to me. By hurting me, the business owner (meager and tenuous as that status may be,) how are you helping the "little guy?"
Of course, people needs jobs & when people have jobs things are usually better. I don't want to hurt any business person, but I don't want to favor business with the exclusion of protecting workers, i.e., minimum wage, family leave, over-time, outsourcing, etc.

We definitely need to draw a balance, but most of the Republican's I know would gladly undo the list above & would favor business solely. They would un-do environmental laws if it hurt business.

Also, we need special incentives for the small businessman like yourself. We need to make sure that other fees levied against business man are reasonable.

However, I would argue that having ~41 million people w/o health care is bad for business, it's bad for our economy (because someone has to pay) and it's bad for our country.

Do you really think that it's wise to listen to one person to get all of your information about one party's goals?
No but I'm just saying that Grover will give you insight into the current pulse of the party/admin.

PS - everyone gets out of work 1 hour early on full moons - Neil Young and Crazy Horse national holiday!!!
However, I would argue that having ~41 million people w/o health care is bad...

Can we agree on something? Being "without health care" and without health care INSURANCE is not the same thing. I know a LOT of people without insurance, and I've been there myself. I've never been without health care... nor have any of the others I know. My Amish friends don't carry insurance, for one large group of examples.

My bad - health care insurance it is. You are very wise to carry insurance. One bad luck incident is the differnece between living in a house or being on the street.

My son was born prematurely & my wife was at bed rest in the hospital for 10 weeks. The bill amounted to over $40,000. If we hadn’t had health care insurance, we might have not been able to survice financially.

I know the truth of that, Mike - it does suck to be without insurance, but it doesn’t mean that you’ll die on the street if you need care. You MIGHT die in debtor’s prison though.

My point being what it was… thank you for acknowledging it.

Pete, it sounds like you are doing what MANY people in my area are doing to make a living. That is owning a “small” business which provides a product or service(s) to larger businesses or corporations. The plant I work for regularly “farms” out machine work and the like. It appears to me that if the “big” businesses are healthy and doing well, the “small” businesses benefit too. Our area is not one of enormous industrialization but the ones who ARE here add millions to the local economies by keeping the “small” businesses in work. I don’t think one can survive without the other. Structuring the tax system so its fair to all is going to be tough IMO.

TG

Yes, my primary customers at this moment are the engineering houses that build assembly lines - though most of these are leaving the country to places where it is cheaper to do business.

I have several new directions going right now. Each has a lot of promise, but these things don’t happen overnight. I’ve fulfilled one contract for one of these new items, but it hasn’t yet panned out as I had hoped. Ah well.

You did nail down the food chain though. As far as the taxes, do check out the Fair Tax site. The flat tax would simply remove ALL taxes at the manufacturing/producing level. Imagine… we would be on a more even playing field with the rest of the world! The distinction between “large” and “paltry” (like mine) crept into the discussion somewhere after the fact.

I used to go my wife’s grandparent’s summer home in Port Sanilca, MI. There was a retired machinist across the street that I used to talk to all the time.

My impression with Michigonians is that every other one has a patent for something. I was impressed by this BTW. However, don’t you have Dept’s of Equalization - that term would never fly in New England!