midi sustain

I just bought an East-West Bosendorfer and a Galaxy5.1 piano. It comes with a komptk player like GPO does. When recording midi with the keyboard and live button engaged, n-track is not recording the sustain controller below the G key (first one below middle C). I have tried it as a vsti and all ways I can think of but won’t record or play the sustain below G. If I play the samples thru the komptk player in standalone mode it works fine. But I want to be able to record the midi and audio at the same time thru n-track.
Anyone got some ideas?
Thanks,
Larrye

MIDI sustain events are non-note specific so this won’t be happeing by anything n-Tracks could be doing. They are channel specific just as notes are. There could be some other stray MIDI events in there that could selectively mess up the sustain the way you describe. Open up the MIDI track in the event list view. Let’s see what’s in there. It’s hard to speculate more without knowing what events we are looking at.

Phoo,
Thanks a million for helping. I will open it up here in a little bit. Got some honeydo to do first.

Larrye

MMMmmmmmm…Melons!!!

Yes, wishful thinking, I know. :)

Phoo,
I check piano roll properties for sustain.
In the upper registers (above aprox middle C) it seems to work fine, I get the normal C64 controller on channel 7 with a value of 127 for pedal down and C64 on channel 7 with a value of 0 for pedal up. In the lower registers where it does not work properly, I am getting C64 data on channels like 2 or 3 with a value of 0. If I strike a key, then pedal down it will sustain but as soon as I strike another key it will turn the sustain off. I stretched the time roll way out it appears there are several 0 values very close together, all C64 data values of 0 on channels 2-3-4.

Man, I sure hope you can help, as it would be GREATLY APPRECIATED.
Larrye
PS- Honeydew is my favorite melon of all, IF they are really white!!!

This must be a problem with your keyboard. Perhaps you have some split keyboard configured or something (but that doesn’t quite make sense either).

When playing no notes, you should be able to press the pedal down and record the C64 0 event. Likewise for pedal up. These events are completely independent of what notes you’re playing.

But evidently, if you happen to be holding certain keys down when you press the pedal, there’s no sustain (C64) event?

That won’t be n-Track. For some reason, your MIDI keyboard isn’t sending the C64 event in some circumstances. Or perhaps it’s sending it on a different MIDI channel due to keyboard splits (though I don’t quite believe that myself).

One thing you can try is to install MIDIOX and run it, and show the input events. It will print each MIDI event as it comes into the computer, so you can see whether it’s your keyboard. (It’s a bit confusing to set up the first time, IIRC.)

Learjet,
I think it might be the keyboard config. It"s a Baldwin pianovelle PS 1000. It is my sister in laws and she has lost the manual. I don’t know anything much about Keyboards and this thing has a LOT of buttons. The darn thing plays fine through the built in speakers and it will even sustain correctly in standalone mode of kompkat, but it won’t sustain correctly as a vsti in n-track. I did find on the keyboard display that there is a splt(?) at F#3. This is about the location where it stops sustaining properly.
Thanks,
Larrye

OK,
Thanks for your help guys!! I got it working. I figured out how to change the keyboard split and save the config. I just moved the split all the way to the bottom and now it records just fine.

Electronics and computers DRIVE ME CRAZY. At 60 years of age it takes me a long time to learn new things, but I am learning.

Thanks again,
Larrye

I had a problem last night that is similar to this topic post.

When I record from my keyboard, the sustain information seems to be recorded just fine into n-track. The problem is that when I try to copy the part that I played (in this case an electric piano part on the chorus) to other positions in the song, the sustain information is not there when I paste. The is very annoying because the whole feel of the part is lost without the sustain pedal. Any ideas why it would not paste along with the other information? The velocity information is fine.

rod

There are two solutions to your problem.

The cause is simple: you’re only copying the selected events. So the first solution is to cause the CC events (and all events) to be displayed so you can select them all.

Another way that I find is even easier, especially when copying whole measures, is to do the copy/paste in the timeline view rather than the MIDI piano roll editor. Do this with the grid on, of course! (Ditto for copying in piano roll: the notes go where the cursor is, and if you don’t have the grid on and the first note isn’t aligned to the grid, you probably won’t get what you want.)

Note that pasting is different in timeline view versus piano roll view:

In piano roll, you set the time cursor (vertical line) and paste, and the first note starts there. All selected events are copied. Invisible events can’t be selected and are not copied.

In timeline view, you select the region to copy to, and the start of the copied region (regardless of whether there’s a note there) is pasted to the beginning of the selected region. So, this method is better for copying measures when the first event doesn’t start at the beginning of the measure. All events are copied, not just the ones drawn in the view. (You can configure which kinds of events get drawn, btw.)

Thanks so much!! I just clicked on the hammer icon and chose view - controller 64 (sustain) and that did it. Not very intuitive and I could find that explained in the manual,either.

Before choosing to view it in the piano roll with the hammer icon I could see the sustain info in the pane at the bottom where the vertical lines are drawn to represent volume and other info. I didn’t realize that I needed to view this kind of info in the piano roll itself in order to copy it correctly.

BTW When I want to make sure I have a section copied from the begining to the end of a measure, I draw one long note the length of what I want to copy. When I select the section and include that one long note, I know it will paste exactly from the begining of the measure.




Thanks again,

Rod

True, but it won’t necessarily get all notes unless you drag a rectangle around them. I put a one-measure note at the beginning – I don’t see any benefit to stretching it to the full length. But if that helps you, don’t let me stop you!

The feedback to indicate what gets copied is that only selected objects are moved. You can see when objects are selected, and you can see that the pedal events in the bottom window aren’t selected when you drag a rectangle.

It’s a very difficult job to design an intuitive GUI. There are a number of improvements that could be made to n-Track’s MIDI piano roll editor, but I find that the suggestions most people make would end up causing more confusion elsewhere. So expect a few growing pains. We know how it is, we’ve all been there!

The manual is due for another update. It got a big update not too long ago, but that was just before the Version 4 work. The best way to improve the manual might be for someone to start a thread and have folks post any issues they see. Then at least Flavio would have one place to go the next time he decides to dig into that.