Mix v.20 is up

I’ve done a few different things to this mix, mainly time aligning kick and snare to the OH, just using a limiter on the main mix instead of Ozone, retracked a few guitars. Lemme know what you think.

http://users.ncable.net.au/~bakka/lazy/LGT-EndOfSpecies.mp3

Willy.

Sounds to me like the timings off on the drums. Maybe you time aligned to much or something.

Weird. I didn’t touch the OH, just slid the kick and snare to match (two tenths of bugger all).

It fattened up the snare no end.

Yeah, the drums do sound alittle “hiccupy”. However, I think that may be what you were after as they are right in the pocket and then there are little 1/4 measures with ghost notes etc where they seem to stutter. Dig the guitar tone and the groove. Kind of a Sabbath/Rage sort of thing… and to me that is a very good thing.

Cool song… I’d like to hear the vox be a little lower in the mix so that the instruments could be louder, making for a thicker mix…

Try re-aligning the drums, but use the snare as the reference, not the overheads - the overheads would lag farther behind the beat because they are farther away from the source, yes?

BTW, “Wheaties” is still one of my favorites. :D

:cool:

So… is it good or bad? I’m reading Bubba’s response as a mixed review…?

Well, it depends on what you are after. Personally, my ear hears the snare grace/ghost notes as not being entirely on tempo. But I know myself I sometimes go for a stuttery electronic remix sound. If that isn’t what you were after, you may want to see if you can get the timing on the snare tightened up. But as I said, I totally dig what’s up with everything else. My 2 cents and all that. In the end, if that is what you want, go with it. IUf you are listening to it and are like “what the hel l is he talking about” then leave it. I mean this with all sincerity as there are a ton of stylistic things that made someone famous that without it, they would have just been another face in the crowd. SO I am careful to frame comments like this. I myself will sometimes take someone’s opinion and totally blow it off as what they were complaining about is what I wanted. Nothing ruins something like a commitee. :;):

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Well, it depends on what you are after. Personally, my ear hears the snare grace/ghost notes as not being entirely on tempo.


Could it be the gate on the snare kicking in innappropriately?

I don’t think so. I really think it is a perfromance thing.

Cool tune…definately a performance issue on the drums…some beats are noticeably out of time…maybe a simpler, more “powerful” drum part is the answer (less accenting)? Mix sounds a tad thin to me for the genre. I like the vox. Not sure I like the guitar tone…like the distortion concept but they sound a little “poddy” or direct to me. I could wrong, I frequently am :)

Ray

maybe a click track is a thing to consider. The guitars are an amped VS102r. No pods or modellers, although I did mess around with them.

Hi Willy:
It takes a while for me download music files so I end up missing a good portion of the Board Member’s creativity… But I downloaded your project and found I was surprised to hear the mix… you posted… It’s seldom I find myself in this part of the Board… but, I’ve always liked listening to your Drum tracks…

On the technical side , the tracks are “captured and presented” very well and sounds like the work you always present to the board. On the musical end, what I hear it doesn’t sound like the music you are connected. to… or what I’ve heard you post, in the past… Musically, it’s pretty “Loose”… Maybe, it’s the direction you want to go with the ideas you have in mind…

Keep up the excellent tracking, you always do…

Bill…

Hmmm… Interesting comments Bill - very positive and constructive without being harsh.

I think I’m aiming for “tight”. Nathan (the drummer) has expressed that he’s not real happy with it. Could be because I set up the gear after our first practice in 1.5 years.

So, the consensus is roughly: “Recorded and mixed well, song is cool, but performance is lacking - Willy, you’re polishing a turd”?

Willy.

Hi Willy:
I stand corrected, but I think the opening idea of your topic is and was to “Time-Align” the drum tracks with the song… And somehow I think that the Over-head mic tracks were used as the “Reference” that you aligned the drum tracks…to… ??

You might consider this, and… if I were in your shoes with the tracks you have… I would mute the overhead tracks and Slip-and-Slide the dominate tracks (Kick, Snare, Hats, and Toms) excluding the Cymbal hits, for now… and bring the dominate voices of the drum tracks into alignment with the “Meter/Measure” of the song… I would consider the Cymbal tracks and Overhead tracks as embellishment to the general feel and dynamics of the song with the rest of the other tracks… and use them at a time after you feel comfortable with the way everything else sounds, together…

At some point-in-time and after I had the the drum tracks in sync with the other tracks and “On-the-Meter” I would Slip-and-“Sample/Slide” the Kick and Bass tracks to give at least those tracks their own “Space” and not to be consistent with the Sample-Slide… If they’re too consistent they will sound mechanical… and have no human feel…

I can’t ever remember even considering this kind of editing when we used tape… Back then , we would move the bass and drum kit and other instrument tracks, in relation to each other… in the song Space and adjust mic placement… to pull that off…

Now, I find I’m doing more and more of this type of editing in the projects I get involved with…

With this ability to adjust this “Sample-Sliding” of tracks, I find that I can play with “Phasing” of instruments with-in
individual track combinations… Before DAW’s… who ever thought one could play with this??

In my opinion, you are one of THE Trackers and Producers around this Board…

Bill…

Definately not a turd brother! Tighten up that drum part and this thing is a go! ALL of the major label sessions I have been to had a click track…just food for thought…

Ray

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In my opinion, you are one of THE Trackers and Producers around this Board…

Well, holy crap, that’s a compliment and a half! Thanks Bill.

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Now, I find I’m doing more and more of this type of editing in the projects I get involved with…

With this ability to adjust this “Sample-Sliding” of tracks, I find that I can play with “Phasing” of instruments with-in
individual track combinations… Before DAW’s… who ever thought one could play with this??

I’m finding that I’m doing more little “production” tricks now. I don’t know how noticable they are on their own, but there’s a few volume drops in the gaps and pans on slides and parts of the riffs that imo just give the song a little more “movement”. Ideally I guess, I’d like it to be so that if you noticed it you’d say “That’s a cool thing to have there”, but without it the mix wouldn’t be as dynamic if you get my drift.

Willy.
Quote (rsolinski @ Aug. 26 2006,23:18)
Definately not a turd brother! Tighten up that drum part and this thing is a go!

Agreed.

Hey Bill, are you still using the yorkvilles? Have you got a sub with the pair or not? I’m having trouble judging the amount to bottom end to “include”, especially in the kick. It’ll sound nice to me, but if I take it to a home stereo type setup, the kick sounds huge, but too big, if you get my drift. The current mix that’s up isn’t the worst one, but I was wondering what you thought of that.

Willy.

Hi Willy and all:
I’d like to be able to spend more time in this studio I have… I wish there were more hours in the day for me to be able to what I want to do… Just when I think I have finished for the day and I have some hours left in the day, I’ve discovered I’ve run outta energy and I start looking for some sleep…

I’m still looking for that math formula for placing monitors in your Listening area/room… I put it somewhere where I wouldn’t forget where it was… I remember that I scratched it down on a piece of paper…

That’s the last I know, of it…

Anyway, for those of you that didn’t know, I had a pair of Tannoy Monitors for at least 10 years… I got pretty used to listening to how they responded… Then one day the amp failed and the right channel dumped some DC into the right box and that was the end of them…

It’s not the loss of the monitor system… It’s the loss of what you’re used hearing as a reference…

To replace the loss I installed a pair of Yorkville Powered monitor cabinets… They have caused me to wake up and listen to everything I’ve ever tracked and mixed, sense I’ve been doing this stuff… Thank you Willy, and my late friend Leonard, for pointing me to these boxes…

But, I do have a sub Bottom End set-up attached to the reference system I have, in the studio… It’s a pair of JBL 2205 15" speakers in a tuned box that’s good down to around 33 - 35 hz. The crossover point is 125 hz. But full range goes into the Yorkies… and the bottom end of the crossover goes to a Yamaha P 2200 power amp, to each JBL 15" speaker…

Willy, in my opinion, it’s not what you hear… I think it’s what you get used to hearing… I like what I hear, in the room but I believe it’s making my ears lazy… The longer I listen to the setup… The lazier my ears become…

In the studio I have the option of five different monitor systems that I can use in any combination to listen to what I’m working on… Now, I’m finding that I’m using the Bottom end less-and-less as I go in there to create mixes…

I don’t like to edit tracks in the same place where I track… If I track in the studio I go to the editing area to play with the tracks… If I track where I edit, i end up going into the studio to edit those tracks… Then I assemble mixes in both places as the project comes together… If I don’t follow that practice, I end up loosing interest in the project…

Before too long my hearing will have progressed to a point where I wouldn’t be able to hear anything I have worked on… the way I should be able to critically, hear it…

I’m finding that my ability to tolerate mixing a project is only lasting a few hours at-a-time… I used to be able to spend all day doing a mix project… Not any more…

I think it’s the Lo-mid, where I’m hurting… The more I listen at it, the less I can tolerate doing a mix… It’s becoming harder for me to be able to place the bottom end in the correct perspective…

Having said that… I know where it is when I listen to mixes, other than mine… I think… but I am unable to find it on my mixes… So, in order to hear the lo-mid I end up having to kill the bottom end till I take another pass at the mixing project… NO-Good, anymore, to do mixing…

I wish I had a faster connection to the internet… Cause I think there some pretty good stuff being posted by the guys that frequent, this and other Boards… It’s frustrating for me, that it takes so long to download it, to be able to hear it…

Bill…