hype the bass or direct all the way?
up until recently, i have been monitoring on bookshelf stereo speakers connected to an old power amplifier (on which i had the bass and treble knobs maxed). i decided to purchase a set of powered (active) monitors in order to give myself a more “accurate” mixing environment and to eliminate this old power amp which has its own set of issues.
i purchsed a pair of yorkville ysm1p’s, which i have connected to the main outs of my mackie mixer.
what i find (and what i expected to find) is that audio is lacking the bass frequencies that my old monitoring system gave me (i am now feeding a direct signal into the powered monitors, where before i was feeding that signal into an amp and boosting bass and treble levels before the speakers).
now i believe that my new monitoring system (taking a direct/unhyped signal) is showing me “what is really there”… so should i just get used to how the direct signal sounds through these monitors, or is it common to introduce a bass/treble adjustement at the mixer (if i do so, i get something closer to what i had before, but of course it is much clearer on the yorkville’s).
Listen to a TON of reference CD’s through your setup to give your ears a reference point. That is KEY to knowing your monitoring system and room IMO. Throw in some CD’s of material similar to what you are trying to record/mix and listen closely.
TG
I’ve come to find that studio monitors are a waste of time if your room is bad. the peaks and valleys in an average room can cause like a 30 db range. pretty freaking horrible. your best bet is to listen to gtr4him, listen to a lot of cds and get your ears used to that sound.
heck, my best mixes have been on the headphones I’m listening to day in and out.
gtr4him is right on - it’s more important to know HOW your monitors are speaking to you in the space that you have them. I have a list of about 50 CD’s that I rotate between when I’m doing some serious mixing. I warm my ears up with a few and refer back during long sessions. Take CD’s that you think sound great, grab a few that other band members suggest then grab a few that other people believe to be great recordings/productions and then just listen, listen, listen. and don’t boost anything.
| Quote (guitars69 @ Feb. 03 2005,10:12) |
| I've come to find that studio monitors are a waste of time if your room is bad. |
Ummmm..... I think good speakers are better than bad speakers in any room, but I get your point that spending a ton on speakers might be overkill if the room really sucks.
This is why small nearfield monitors might be the best first monitor buy. If you can get close to them, then you're hearing less "room".
I completely agree with the advice to have a bunch of favourite reference CDs and to listen to them on as many different systems as possible, with the EQ FLAT (or switched out).
(dimmer77: Bass & Treble maxed? Awww, duuuude....
)
Right, mostly right, right, right.
Make sure you’re really doing “nearfield monitoring”. To do that, it’s VERY important to get those monitors AWAY from the walls – ideally, closer to you than to the walls. They should be roughly at ear height, in an equilateral triangle with your head (same distance between speakers as from either speaker to you), and the distance should be 3 to 6 feet.
It might be hard to get the speakers closer to you than the walls – this is a typical problem. If so, ANYTHING you can do will help a lot, even a foot away, but two feet is much, much better. Can you squeeze 3? Go for it, it matters. Those first 3 feet count the most, I think.
Also, if you’ve been listening with bass and treble cranked, you’ve trained your ears poorly. You’ll have to spend a lot of time (poor you!) listening to all your favorite music in your new monitoring system, with the EQ controls flat. (For starters, anyway.)
Next, levels are very important. Google “Fletcher Munson” to get a clue. You don’t need to understand all the technical goo, just be aware that as you change the volume, your ears repsond to frequencies differently. Hopefully your old amp has a “loudness” switch. If so, TURN IT ON AND LEAVE IT ON. This is a VERY good thing. If not, you’re going to have to learn a bit more about F-M and how to compensate, or else just always mix at 87 dB SPL©.
OK, what the heck is 87 db SPL©?
First, get yourself a cheap Sound Pressure Level (SPL) meter from Radio Shack. The $35 analog one is fine – I don’t think the digital one for $5-10 more is any better; I like it less because waving needles tell you more than digital readouts that change too fast.
Now, put this meter on a stand right where your head would be and step away a bit. Playing a CD you like, adjust the amp volume until it reaches the mid to upper 80’s. This should put you in the sweet spot where your ears and system are all in sync for “flat” response.
If you want, go one more and download [url=http://audio.rightmark.org]RightMark Audio Analyser (RMAA)[/ulr], plug the meter’s output into your soundcard, and benchmark your audio system at this level. Don’t expect a super flat line because RMAA’s graph shows small discrepancies as big dips & bulges (about +/- 3dB full scale, IIRC).
I probably gave you more than you wanted, but you’ve got plenty to get started with here. There’s more, if you want to calibrate your listening environment based on RMAA results, or compensating manually for F-M. I’m gonna have to collect this stuff onto a web page!
PS: I use headphones to do a lot of mixing, but it’s really not a recommend practice. It takes quite a bit of experience and judgement to compensate for the problems that headphones cause. On the other hand, I do it for probably the same reason G69 does – my current monitoring situation is poor, and limited by interior design/decorating issues (arghhh). Of course, I dearly love my interior design consultant, who supports me in my endeavors and tolerates a lot of crap!
Hi Jeff,
As always you’ve provided alot of useful information, with your usual technical rigour. But I have to disagree strongly with the following.
| Quote (learjeff @ Feb. 04 2005,08:24) |
| … Next, levels are very important. Google “Fletcher Munson” to get a clue. You don’t need to understand all the technical goo, just be aware that as you change the volume, your ears repsond to frequencies differently. Hopefully your old amp has a “loudness” switch. If so, TURN IT ON AND LEAVE IT ON. This is a VERY good thing. If not, you’re going to have to learn a bit more about F-M and how to compensate, or else just always mix at 87 dB SPL©. |
Loudness ON… wrong. I would advise to never turn on loudness switch in a monitoring situation. Here’s why.
1) The Fletcher Munsen graph describes the ears’ sensitivity at various sound pressure levels, and the most notable effect is that the sensitivity to bass relative to mid-band is lower at lower SPL, but it does not follow that we therefore MUST always use a bass boost when playing at lower levels.
It’s all down to what you train yourself to. If your situation demands lower monitoring levels, then tweak your situation for that. Maybe even boost the bass a bit (and mark the setting). But do so while going over all your reference material til you’re satisfied you’re hearing what you need to. You cannot rely on a loudness switch to take care of this. The key remains - know your own monitors.
2) What is called a LOUDNESS switch varies between amps. Most acheive this by having a tapped volume control with a capacitor hanging off the tap to suck out some treble at the lower volume settings. It achieves the goal of reduced treble at lower volume settings but it’s only a rough approximation to F-M and doesn’t track the F-M curve that well. And if your monitor signal to the amp is higher or lower than nominal, then the amount of bass compensation wont necessarily reflect the conditions. And speakers can vary wildly in efficiency. And many people just use the monitor level controls on their mixers, and the power amp’s volume stays at a set position, which means theres absolutely no F-M tracking. So there’s very little certanty that the F-M compensation is accurate or being applied correctly.
3) The loudness switch is there so that Mr & Mrs Consumer won’t go diving for the bass control when they’re listening to music at dinner-party level (compared to rockin-out level), as predicted by F-M.
Ever notice that NO professional power amp has a loudness switch? Also note that no consoles (big or small) incorporate loudness contour in their monitor level pot?
I have never encountered a professional room (broadcast, recording, film/TV mix) where a loudness contour was used in the monitoring system. As you pointed out, this is because they’re used to working at a specific sound pressure level (usually 85 to 87 dB SPL ). But the key is that they’re USED to it. You can pick any arbitrary monitoring level (within reason) and get used to it. It’s all down to using that reference material to hear how known good material sounds on your own system.
Anyway, rant over. I’m not saying it’s absolutely wrong or undesirable to boost the bass a bit when monitoring at lower levels, my point is that the consumer amp’s LOUDNESS switch is not the best tool for the job, or a magic bullet.
(Notwithstanding, I’m sure there are folks out there who do have Loudness on, and can do a good job. Again, that’s because they’re USED to it)
Cheers,
ken