The problem with Liberals is that they are too tolerant of others. They try to see the world through other people’s eyes. They try to help others by using these perceptions. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t. Many of the things that make this country great were originally liberal thoughts. Equality, financial protection for the elderly, a reasonable minimum wage… I could go on forever pointing out the positive things Liberals have done for this country.
But those darn Liberals are just too tolerant. They insist on trying to see the other persons viewpoint. Hence, the problem with Kerry and his campaign. He sat on his hands while lies were propagated against him. He accepted the flaws of the current administration as just mistakes rether than take advantage of them in his speeches. He is just too easy on the Conservatives.
The ultra conservative republicans don’t have the same problem. They will do anything to put out their viewpoint. They do not care if there is another viewpoint. They do not care who they hurt or offend. This is their strength. They are without any integrity or morals. They try to sell their morality like a used Pinto, but most people are not buying it. So instead they sell fear. This is an easy sell. Americans are afraid of people down the street much less other countries. This is how they keep in power.
The Liberals need to stop backing up and start taking the offensive. They need to immediately answer idiotic charges made by Right-wing amoralists and send back some of the facts of living in a multicultural world. They need to explain to the American people that it is not alright to have over 15% of your population living below the poverty level. They need to explain that global warming does exist. They need to explain that Iraq is a bust and that our occupation is a huge failure. They need to explain that giving a $400 check to a low income family does not make up for a $3000 a year increase in health insurance.
The Liberals are just too caring.
I had to laugh the other day. A Republican friend of mine asked me,“Don’t you think there are more Atheists in the Democratic party than the Republican party?” I replied,“are you kidding? Jesus believed in helping others. He stated that I would be easier to ride a camel through the eye of a needle than for a wealthy man to get into heaven. Jesus believe in tolerance in loving your fellow man even if it is your enemy. Doesn’t sound like any conservative I know.” Liberals believe in helping those that need it most. Conservatives believe that it is every man for himself. Jesus was no conservative.
The question is, will the liberals get down and dirty with the conservatives? Can they? Isn’t it against their nature ?
Time will tell.
Mike
Well if you listen to some of the right-wing nut cases, they'll tell you that we're the ones who are dirty & liars & who go around murdering people, smearing opponents, stealing documents, blah, blah, blah.
I think liberals have been forced to get down dirty to deal with the right-wing. We didn't used to be that way but now we have to.
| Quote (MidnightToker @ Sep. 23 2004,18:04) |
| I think liberals have been forced to get down dirty to deal with the right-wing. We didn't used to be that way but now we have to. |
I think you are right MT, but I don't believe that they have got the "down and dirty" part right yet. The Right wing is so good at it that it boggles the mind and insults the spirit. I laugh every time I hear about the wonderful conservative morals. I believe most conservative Republicans are moral, but those in power are riding on the majoritys coat tails claiming their moral fiber. It is an insult to integrity and morality.
Mike
A faction of the Repubs has been perfecting this strategy since Nixon. They have very long term goals, and understand well the age-old political advice one finds in Lao Tzu, e.g.: keep the people stupid, keep them satisfied, make them good workers, and one will rule in peace. Works quite well when lines of information are confused or controlled. But I am enough of a liberal to think that (1) compassion, even when it fails to do everything hoped for, is usually the right attitude, and (2) reason and democracy will win out in the end.
One cannot legislate virtue, it is a matter of choice and individual character, and the worst thing that could happen would be for the Dem party as a whole to give up its moral center. 
We're not as "dirty" as the ultra right-wing, like Rove, etc. but I fear that we'll be there soon because we'll stoop to their tactics. We'll forget what we're fighting for. The end will justify the means for us.
Tom - you're right about the long term goals & there are several. One of those goals is to revise/re-write our Constitutional history in terms of morals/religion, i.e., add God everywhere's that the Founding Fathers deliberately kept it out. That's one of the things that scares me the most because the right-wing is winning right now.
I know I'ved posted this before but it's a poignant article -
Rolling Back the 20th Century
| Quote (DrGuitar @ Sep. 23 2004,17:56) |
| Many of the things that make this country great were originally liberal thoughts. Equality .... |
This is one myth the liberal media has helped Democrats perpetrate. In the last few weeks alone, both the Washington (Com)Post and The Economist alleged that the Republicans have traditionally opposed civil rights legislation. Nothing could be further from the truth. Republicans in Congress actually supported the two most important civil rights bills on record, the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965, in higher percentages than Democrats did. In the House, 80 percent of Republicans voted for the Civil Rights Act, compared with only 63 percent of Democrats. In the Senate, 82 percent of Republicans supported the legislation, compared with 69 percent of Democrats.
Al Gore’s father, as a senator from Tennessee, was one of the Democrats who voted against the Civil Rights Act of 1964. So was Arkansas Sen. William Fulbright, who would go on to be a mentor to Bill Clinton. As recently as the 1980s, the Senate Democrats chose current senator and former Ku Klux Klan member Robert 'KKK' Byrd as their floor leader.
| Quote (DrGuitar @ Sep. 23 2004,17:56) |
| financial protection for the elderly |
Socialism .... ?
| Quote (DrGuitar @ Sep. 23 2004,17:56) |
| a reasonable minimum wage.... |
Could the Dems and BIG Union have ulterior motives .... ?
Do the math, and decide for yourself.
"Most of this money comes directly out of the dues of union members—usually without their permission or even knowledge. Some estimates put the amount unions spend each election cycle in the range of $500-800 million." - LC
Frontpage Interview’s Linda Chavez, the co-author (with Daniel Gray) of Betrayal: How Union Bosses Shake Down Their Members and Corrupt American Politics.
Betrayal - How Union Bosses Shake Down Their Members
FP: Illuminate briefly for us the union influence on elections. How large is it and is it coming from the “hard-left”?
Chavez: Unions represent the largest source of unregulated--in some cases, illegal-- money in politics today. Not only did unions contribute $90.1 million directly to the Democrats in 2000, they also spent $46 million in a grassroots’ effort to mobilize Democratic voters, registered 2.3 million new union household voters, made 8 million phone calls and distributed $14 million leaflets in the workplace, but they also spent untold millions for paid union staff to work directly in Democratic campaigns.
Most of this money comes directly out of the dues of union members—usually without their permission or even knowledge. Some estimates put the amount unions spend each election cycle in the range of $500-800 million. What’s more, most unions don’t pay taxes on that portion of their dues spent on politics, even though they are required by law to do so. The National Education Association, the nation’s largest and one of the wealthiest (almost $350 million in revenues in 2002), claims it spends zero on politics, yet the NEA maintains a staff of 1,800 political operatives, more than the combined staff of the Democratic and Republican National Committees combined.
This year, the unions will spend even more than they did in 2000. The AFL-CIO has committed some $44 million to a “beat Bush” effort. One New York City local of the Service Employees International Union has pledged $35 million to defeating the president—not one penny of which will be spent in New York, where the union’s members live and work, because New York is safely in Kerry’s column.
| Quote (DrGuitar @ Sep. 23 2004,17:56) |
|
The Liberals are just too caring. |
... Imagine how many poor children these "all to caring Libs" could feed with $500-800 million (?)
| Quote (DrGuitar @ Sep. 23 2004,17:56) |
|
I could go on forever .... |
Most Libs usually can .....
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We've been through this before. The Democrats that voted against the CRA were Dixie-crats & were different then other Democrats. After the Civil War, many Republicans from the South became Democrats.
But forget about the Dixie-crats, what party pushed the act through. It was the Democrats & that's the most important thing to remember!!! It was LBJ that got the bill through, so Burning-SGs points are WAY OFF!!!
| Quote (MidnightToker @ Sep. 24 2004,13:41) |
| The Democrats that voted against the CRA were Dixie-crats & were different then other Democrats. |
I guess it depends on what the meaning of Demorat, is ....
| Quote (DrGuitar @ Sep. 23 2004,13:41) |
|
Many of the things that make this country great were originally liberal thoughts. ... |
Yes, indeed ....
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Most of those guys are Republicans now. There was a great purging of the Old Southern Dixiecrats when large droves jumped party in the 70’s and 80’s. A few held out and are still Democrats. Almost all my family in NC were democrats, then they all switched to republican because the democrat party no longer voiced their ideals, but the republican party did. Want to see what my great white family looked like back then? Watch Mississippi Burning.
And you my friend don’t understand history very well because it was the Democrat’s who fought & got the Civil Rights Act passed.
It was the Southern Democrats who formed the States’ Rights Democratic Party (Dixiecrats) & choose Thurmond as its presidential candidate. Guess what party Thurmond ended up being in - the Republican Party. The same party whose previous Senate leader, Trent Lott, said that Thurmond had it right back then & they all voted for him.
The final count showed 44 Democrats and 27 Republicans voting for cloture (to end the fillibuster) with 23 Democrats - 20 from the South – and only 6 Republicans opposed.
Please don’t re-write history.
| Quote (MidnightToker @ Sep. 24 2004,14:29) |
| And you my friend don't understand history very well because it was the Democrat's who fought & got the Civil Rights Act passed. Please don't re-write history. |
Is it your contention that the Libs are soley responsible for civil rights ?
Have you heard of Dwight D. Eisenhower, Mr. Charlie ?
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Eisenhower was in the Klan? I had no idea!
Good one - phoo!
Ike was the last good republican president. Since then, Nixon, a crook, Ford, well, he’s from Michigan so I won’t pick on him too much, but he did pardon Nixon, um Reagan, Bush and Bush.
And by “good” I mean both “morally good” and “competent.” I would have voted for Ike.
Anyway, what did LBJ say when he got the civil rights act passed? Something about giving the south to the Repubs for the next 50 years? I can’t quite remember the quote…
Burning-SG., good job.
Even if I had the free time, and the typing skills,I doubt I could done a better job.
Congrats,
Jeff
I would reply to BS-Guy, but he is and always will be a non-entity. It is typical though for a hard right winger to try to rewrite history. The hard right are not even close to Republicans in their ideals. They hang their hats on the Republican party and are the loud mouth of it, but they are hardly Republican in thought or deed. So I don’t blame the Republicans for the current debacle (point in any direction and you will find one), I blame those that think and speak like BS-Guy. It is really very sad actually.
Mike
| Quote (DrGuitar @ Sep. 25 2004,00:08) |
| I would reply to BS-Guy, but .... |
Dr-Loser,
But what .... ? You just did
Do continue though, your posts are always good for a laugh.
Now that's entertainment !!!
Dr-Loser - "I voted for responding to SG, before I voted against responding "
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I was thinking about how hard right wingers tend toward narcissistic
behavior. They see themselves as superior and are self centered. It could easily be argued that hard right wingers are both. Look at the right wing platform. They want, want, want, but are unwilling to give. They look down on any person that is not with them in their views. They believe they are above anyone in need and should not help take care of them.
It is for these reasons that I believe that the hard right wing will fall back into obscurity in the next 20 years. They are in their hayday right now…but as often is the case with extremists, they will be pushed from the limelight soon enough. We just have to hope that the damage they do isn’t permanent (like the huge deficit).
Mike
You got that right Dr. Guitar!