Look. I’ll let John speak his own mind… but heres how I see things. (And for whatever it’s worth, I think a buttload of everyday folks agree.) The “left” has never been so far left and the “right” has never been so far right as far as I can recall. Thats the problem as I see it. You got the Dems on one side and the Repubs on the other chucking rocks at each other and not getting ANYTHING done. It’s a joke! Both parties need to get their crap together and work for the good of the country, NOT their extreme radical views which seem to have taken over government. It’s the same with ANY politician regardless of party affiliation, first on their minds is “What’s in it for me?” Second is “How do I play this up to make ME LOOK GOOD?” Third is “Is this good for MY party?” Fourth is “How’s this affect MY district?” Somewhere down around tenth or so is where the good of the country as a WHOLE comes to mind.
So there it is…the Golden Rule of American politics…"Screw thy neighbor BEFORE thy neighbor screws you! What?..Constituents? Wazzat?..Oh, oh…nah…I had it there for a minute…"
TG
EDIT** So to sum it up, at least for the moment, the Democratic and Republican parties BOTH suck!
I agree about the right but seriously, the left is no where's near as left as it was in the 60's/70's. Why do you feel this way about the left? Who on the left exemplifies this? Surely not Kerry for example. Is it Dean?
Clinton was completely a centrist/moderate & he went along w/ the Republicans on many issues that more left-leaning Democrat's wouldn't have, e.g., NAFTA & welfare.
My take is that you've completely bought into right-wing media that distorts, lies & exaggerates things we "liberal"s do & believe in.
Takayama - you got John's view of Democrat's correct. They give me a hard time because they don't like me
Mr Soul
Since I was born in '63…the 60’s and 70’s were “Politics? Whats that?” years for me.
I guess I get that view from either sides inability or willingness to budge on anything these days. They’d rather sit around taking cheap shots at each other while the whole house of cards caves in!
Oh, I saw an interview with Christine Todd Whitman on TV. She’s saying pretty much the same thing as I am. I have not read her book. Probably won’t either. Got better uses for my time. I just want our elected officials to quit with the petty nit-picking and find solutions to Iraq, the trade deficit with China, the Nat’l debt, Illegal Immigrants (Seriously. A teenager can’t get a job around here. The I.I.'s have 'em all!) etc…
Maybe we would have been better off with Kerry? We certainly will never know…
TG
…
She was on the Al Franken show yesterday. It wasn't the best interview because Franken was trying to get her to say REALLY negative things about Bush, which she didn't do. I'd like to read the book but I agree with you about the time issue.
Maybe we would have been better off with Kerry? We certainly will never know...........
Well I'm glad at least you consider the notion. We'd be better off at least 2 reasons: 1) One party would not be in power, 2) two parties in power creates gridlock which some people think is good.
If Kerry were Pres, I don't think he'd be considering attacking or invading other Islamic countries, unless he absolutely had to. I think he'd have the same problems in Iraq but I think he would focus more on Al Quada/Bin Laden then Bush is doing.
Mr Soul
There will always be extremists. They balance each other out in the shouting matches and actually serve a purpose to provide perspective. It’s best if the pendulum of actual policy hangs near the center, swinging just a little to either side.
I agree with Mr Soul that the Dems are in general not too far left. The whole collective political outlook of the US is way too far to the right, it’s out of balance. Even the party of the left, the dems, are actually right-of-center. The only thing that’s good about it is that it will swing the other way when the current cabal pushes their extreme right agenda too far, and average americans finally wake up to the lie that this extremism is somehow for the good of the average american.
An extreme leftie is a communist. I never heard Mr Soul or anybody on this forum extoll the virtues of communism. Mr Soul can defend himself quite well, but I think you’re all hassling him a bit too much.
For one, I'm not an extreme leftist but when a Democrat starts raising fairly moderate concerns, like what the h*ll is this war in Iraq all about for example, they are branded as an extremist by the far right-wing (who are in control today).
For the record, I don't believe in communism & I know of no Democrat or liberal that exposes communism (although I'm sure that some do). Democrat's, for the most part, believe in our consitutional system & our laws. A big difference is taht we do believe that government can help the average person, but that does NOT make us communists.
My major concern is that the USA has gone far, far to the right, that many on the right lie & distort the truth, and that we as a nation will suffer before people wake up & see exactly what's going on, i.e., that big business controls the media, the government & just about everything.
Mr Soul
| Quote (Mr Soul @ Jan. 28 2005,16:06) |
| people wake up & see exactly what's going on, i.e., that big business controls the media, the government & just about everything. |
I realized THAT a LONG time ago......
TG
| Quote (nergle @ Jan. 28 2005,15:12) |
I was only asking why the USA used Blue for left-wing and Red for right-wing!   Ali |
I don't think we will ever know Ali.........
TG
…
| Quote (nergle @ Jan. 28 2005,17:15) |
| just a label with zero semantic content but high emotional content that we can use to manipulate public opinion. |
Excellent point Ali-nergle. That's the problem with "labels". We are too quick to label something as "bad" and forever bad it shall be.
TG
PS Did you ever hear the expression "Give the dog a bad name and hang it!"
Yep, nergle, in the USA we are nearly incapable of making any distinctions beyond “commies” and “patriots.” (seriously)
Personally, I blame those war-mongering fascistic republican commies. (kidding)
The Point. Oblio
Any thinking outside the majority in the states will get you labeled.
I was labeled once, by the wife. But it was for her yard sale, man was I cheap too.
…
| Quote (Takayama @ Jan. 28 2005,02:17) | ||
He doesn't have to. It's very clear by all of his comments what he thinks of Democrats. |
My girlfriend is a Democrat.
Go stick it in yer pipe.
I have nothing against Democrats. It's the whiny, knee-jerk, mantra-following, "selected-not-elected", "no-blood-for-oil", "Bush is a Nazi", hypocratic, idiot, cry-baby liberal types that I can't stand. Which one are you?
And btw, Kerry was a horrible canidate, regardless of affiliation.
Why do you say that John? Even my 12 year old said to me, when watching the debates, "Geez Dad, that guy [Kerry] sure sounds better than Bush." I think he would have been a very good President, which is why I voted for him. Your statement sounds like a right-wing mantra to me.
| Quote (nergle @ Jan. 28 2005,17:15) |
| What's wrong with communism? |
Name one country where it has been successful.
Communism is when the state owns the means and methods of production, as opposed to private industry.
| Quote (Mr Soul @ Jan. 31 2005,13:03) |
| And btw, Kerry was a horrible canidate, regardless of affiliation. |
Why do you say that John? Even my 12 year old said to me, when watching the debates, "Geez Dad, that guy [Kerry] sure sounds better than Bush." I think he would have been a very good President, which is why I voted for him. Your statement sounds like a right-wing mantra to me.
Ok. So Kerry was sucessful at impressing a 12 year old. That's why we don't let 12 year olds vote.
In his attempt to pander to everyone, Kerry came accross as not standing firm on anything. Ya know... the ole "flip-flop" thing didn't come from nothing.
| Quote (Mr Soul @ Jan. 31 2005,13:03) |
| Your statement sounds like a right-wing mantra to me. |
Aww that's cute. You like my word? Maybe you should understand what it means before you poke your eye out:
Mantra == Incantation == "a written or recited formula of words designed to produce a particular effect"
Sheesh.
Now I listened to what Kerry said directly & didn't come away with this impression. Don't you think the flip-flop label was the result of the opposition defining him? And let me ask you a question - do you think Bush did any flip-flops, because if you didn't, I can find a whole bunch of them.
Actually, I was quite impressed with my son's perception. He knows that both his mom & I are Democrat's but we always impress upon our children to make their own minds up about things (politics).
I know what mantra means John & to be honest with you, you always sound like you're regurgitating right-wing spin to me.